Worked on this last night…more to be done; more ambiguities to be built in and I have to shift the male/female dynamic a bit, but a start nonetheless. Comments welcome.
Jerry said
“you can damn near
conjure up
anything you want these days —
need to make anything happen
you can do it —
as long as someone bleeds elsewhere
f’r instance, the clothes you wear are awesome
threads and I bet they were a bargain
at least in part because
of blood on needles
in Singapore or
Hong Kong
that imported out of season fruit you eat to stay
so improbably slender
had to be picked by someone
so many of our illusions and dreams in this country
can only exist
if someone’s back is bent below them elsewhere in the world”
Jerry said this to Eileen
as he tapped on the keyboard
with his impeccable hands
Eileen felt properly
chastened for a moment
then chalked the diatribe up
to Jerry’s
passion for
condescension
but secretly knew
she’d be checking labels closely
from now on
meanwhile
at the restaurant on the corner
the delivery man, Nguyen Van Tu, who had been a mechanic in Saigon
back before it changed its name to Ho Chi Minh City
smoked one last Marlboro Red before
stepping out into the street and slipping
under the wheels of the crosstown bus that
carried so many people home
from their late jobs
all those dinners
were scattered all over
the street that was so black with rain
when the ambulance came
jerry got up from the keyboard
and slammed the window shut
then the restaurant owner called to say the
dry string beans and
strange flavor chicken
would be late and Jerry
cancelled the order
entirely
in a snit he swore
never to eat
at the Imperial China again
before turning back to
the MoveOn
website
to write an impassioned letter
to his representative
to the media
all the time watching his words
to avoid unnecessarily
angering anyone
who might be
monitoring this site
not saying the obvious
the wrong people
are always
bleeding
Dark Matter 
March 4th, 2004 at 2:41 pm
Re: Hmmmmm…..
Or, perhaps, you could develop a bit ending so the threads come together in a more obvious way.
March 4th, 2004 at 2:41 pm
Re: Hmmmmm…..
Or, perhaps, you could develop a bit ending so the threads come together in a more obvious way.
March 4th, 2004 at 2:01 pm
Hmmmmm…..
I kinda like the clean break between the threads, honestly…but I might find a reasonable place to put some foreshadowing in earlier.
The real theme here, for me, is hypocrisy — how the seemingly “aware” Jerry misses forms of oppression that are right under his nose.
March 4th, 2004 at 2:01 pm
Hmmmmm…..
I kinda like the clean break between the threads, honestly…but I might find a reasonable place to put some foreshadowing in earlier.
The real theme here, for me, is hypocrisy — how the seemingly “aware” Jerry misses forms of oppression that are right under his nose.
March 4th, 2004 at 1:50 pm
Another thing — I think you have at least two different threads going on.
* 1) Jerry and Eileen
* 2) mechanic and Jerry
I think you need to gel them more. One way would be to add other threads and make this work much longer, containing other threads.
Or maybe you have a few poems here, that will add up to something bigger.
Not sure what to do with it, by “meanwhile” is too weak a connection.
So what is the central theme – -words, typing, ambiguty? Not sure …
March 4th, 2004 at 1:50 pm
Another thing — I think you have at least two different threads going on.
* 1) Jerry and Eileen
* 2) mechanic and Jerry
I think you need to gel them more. One way would be to add other threads and make this work much longer, containing other threads.
Or maybe you have a few poems here, that will add up to something bigger.
Not sure what to do with it, by “meanwhile” is too weak a connection.
So what is the central theme – -words, typing, ambiguty? Not sure …
March 4th, 2004 at 12:55 pm
Yup.
That’s exactly the kind of detail I need to work on, Stefan — thank you!
March 4th, 2004 at 12:55 pm
Yup.
That’s exactly the kind of detail I need to work on, Stefan — thank you!
March 4th, 2004 at 12:54 pm
I brilliant idea.
I would work on imagery. E.g., “the clothes you wear” — show those clothes and the seasonal fruit. You will not need to say as much as you do.
March 4th, 2004 at 12:54 pm
I brilliant idea.
I would work on imagery. E.g., “the clothes you wear” — show those clothes and the seasonal fruit. You will not need to say as much as you do.
March 4th, 2004 at 11:45 am
Re: By the way —
not a bad idea, Mr. Brown =)
March 4th, 2004 at 11:45 am
Re: By the way —
not a bad idea, Mr. Brown =)
March 4th, 2004 at 11:37 am
Re: By the way —
Tweaks, I think, more than anything else…but this dimension concerns me enough to want to really be sure about that.
I also like the ambiguity in the relationship, but the power dynamics worried me (or rather, the apparent power dynamics) — I was concerned that I’ve clearly made the male the bad guy here, and that wasn’t what I wanted.
Maybe if I change Eileen into a guy, too…hmmmm…
March 4th, 2004 at 11:37 am
Re: By the way —
Tweaks, I think, more than anything else…but this dimension concerns me enough to want to really be sure about that.
I also like the ambiguity in the relationship, but the power dynamics worried me (or rather, the apparent power dynamics) — I was concerned that I’ve clearly made the male the bad guy here, and that wasn’t what I wanted.
Maybe if I change Eileen into a guy, too…hmmmm…
March 4th, 2004 at 11:32 am
Re: By the way —
I don’t like that he lectures her, but at the same time I do like that he lectures her…
i think the condescending conversation could take place btwn. any two people, mf, mm, ff – i’ve run into it myself in a variety of contexts. i do like that the woman keeps her cool, writes it off as him liking condescention. i don’t need her to get back up in his face – she notes it, she mostly writes him off as arrogant. the admission of knowing she will be checking labels, imho, is strictly honest – a confession that most of us can make when there’s a kernal of truth to an arrogant fuck-o’s soapbox stance. the guy’s bedside manner, for lack of a better term, sucks, even if he is pointing out something important. ok, it’s bigger than that – this isn’t a nice guy. & a lot of people aren’t either.
i think it’s a very good observation of the human animal. life as we know it is relatively un-p.c. i think what you say here in this interaction is more important than making any pat statement about the was things ought to be.
are you still sanding on this? seems like there’s more coming…
March 4th, 2004 at 11:32 am
Re: By the way —
I don’t like that he lectures her, but at the same time I do like that he lectures her…
i think the condescending conversation could take place btwn. any two people, mf, mm, ff – i’ve run into it myself in a variety of contexts. i do like that the woman keeps her cool, writes it off as him liking condescention. i don’t need her to get back up in his face – she notes it, she mostly writes him off as arrogant. the admission of knowing she will be checking labels, imho, is strictly honest – a confession that most of us can make when there’s a kernal of truth to an arrogant fuck-o’s soapbox stance. the guy’s bedside manner, for lack of a better term, sucks, even if he is pointing out something important. ok, it’s bigger than that – this isn’t a nice guy. & a lot of people aren’t either.
i think it’s a very good observation of the human animal. life as we know it is relatively un-p.c. i think what you say here in this interaction is more important than making any pat statement about the was things ought to be.
are you still sanding on this? seems like there’s more coming…
March 4th, 2004 at 11:22 am
Re: The latter.
this:
The latter.
makes me very happy =) it also makes the poem make more sense.
aside –
i had an inkling about name & sibling order once too. can’t remember very much about it anymore either. but, Tu, if i remember correctly, either means Star or Tree depending upon pronunciation – P’s brother in San Fran; either the second of third brother (of 12 siblings!) – but that may not mean much, as most of the sibs had either American or Chinese names…
March 4th, 2004 at 11:22 am
Re: The latter.
this:
The latter.
makes me very happy =) it also makes the poem make more sense.
aside –
i had an inkling about name & sibling order once too. can’t remember very much about it anymore either. but, Tu, if i remember correctly, either means Star or Tree depending upon pronunciation – P’s brother in San Fran; either the second of third brother (of 12 siblings!) – but that may not mean much, as most of the sibs had either American or Chinese names…
March 4th, 2004 at 9:22 am
By the way —
any thoughts on the m/f thing I commented on earlier? would love your perspective…
March 4th, 2004 at 9:22 am
By the way —
any thoughts on the m/f thing I commented on earlier? would love your perspective…
March 4th, 2004 at 9:19 am
The latter.
Nguyen is a family name, and in the more traditional usage, is put first. Most Vietnamese immigrants have switched to the American usage of family name last.
I deliberately used the older form.
By the way, the given name (Tu, in this case) is usually indicative of birth order. I used to know all the specifics of how that worked, but haven’t been closely involved with the Vietnamese community in so many years, I’ve forgotten most of what I once knew.
March 4th, 2004 at 9:19 am
The latter.
Nguyen is a family name, and in the more traditional usage, is put first. Most Vietnamese immigrants have switched to the American usage of family name last.
I deliberately used the older form.
By the way, the given name (Tu, in this case) is usually indicative of birth order. I used to know all the specifics of how that worked, but haven’t been closely involved with the Vietnamese community in so many years, I’ve forgotten most of what I once knew.
March 4th, 2004 at 9:14 am
i’m liking where this is going – esp. the image of the dinners scattered all over – much better than the standard explosion; now it’s intimate, yes?
one question:
Nguyen Van Tu
is this right, or should it be Tu Van (Van Tu?) Nguyen? or are you un-americanizing the name? just wonderin’…
March 4th, 2004 at 9:14 am
i’m liking where this is going – esp. the image of the dinners scattered all over – much better than the standard explosion; now it’s intimate, yes?
one question:
Nguyen Van Tu
is this right, or should it be Tu Van (Van Tu?) Nguyen? or are you un-americanizing the name? just wonderin’…
March 4th, 2004 at 9:10 am
Re: i like.
Thanks. Much appreciated.
Here’s my thing about the male female dynamic in this: I don’t like that he lectures her, but at the same time I do like that he lectures her — I feel like I need to either balance the hypocrisy in the couple, or make him the “villain” (relatively speaking, of course — I want to avoid caricature, as you noted) more dramatically, by giving her a stronger response. (Does that make sense?)
Any thoughts?
March 4th, 2004 at 9:10 am
Re: i like.
Thanks. Much appreciated.
Here’s my thing about the male female dynamic in this: I don’t like that he lectures her, but at the same time I do like that he lectures her — I feel like I need to either balance the hypocrisy in the couple, or make him the “villain” (relatively speaking, of course — I want to avoid caricature, as you noted) more dramatically, by giving her a stronger response. (Does that make sense?)
Any thoughts?
March 4th, 2004 at 8:39 am
i like.
last night DaShade did a new (to me) piece called “Fuck a Revolution” that this very much resonates with, so this felt like a turn in the ongoing poetry conversation. putting those contradictions and complexities into a non-caricatured person works beautifully.
no suggestions, just a thumbs up.
March 4th, 2004 at 8:39 am
i like.
last night DaShade did a new (to me) piece called “Fuck a Revolution” that this very much resonates with, so this felt like a turn in the ongoing poetry conversation. putting those contradictions and complexities into a non-caricatured person works beautifully.
no suggestions, just a thumbs up.